mination of Jews. This question followed upon the previous answer of the witness. It is my last question.

THE PRESIDENT: The last sentence of paragraph 7 is with reference to the foul and nauseating stench. What is your question about that?

DR. KAUFFMANN: Whether the population could gather from these things that extermination of Jews was taking place.

THE PRESIDENT: That really is too obvious a question, isn't it? They could not possibly know who it was being exterminated.

DR. KAUFFMANN: That is enough for me. I have no further questions.

DR. PANNENBECKER (counsel for defendant Frick): I ask the Tribunal permission to ask a few supplementary questions for, during cross-examination, the witness stated that the defendant Frick had visited the concentration camps Sachsenhausen and Oranienburg in 1938.


Q. Witness, when an inspection of the concentration camp of Oranienburg took place at that time, 1937, was there any evidence at all of atrocities?

A. No.

Q. Why not?

A. Because there was no question of atrocities at that time.

Q. Is it correct that at that period of time the concentration camp at Oranienburg was still a model of order and efficiency and that agriculture was the main occupation?

A. Yes. However, work was mainly done in workshops, in wood-finishing workshops.

Q. Can you give me any details as to what was shown in that time at such an official visit?

A. Yes. The visiting party was led through the detainee camp proper, inspected the quarters, the kitchen, the hospital, and then all the administrative buildings above all the workshops, where the detainees were employed.

Q. At that time were the quarters and the hospitals already overfilled?

A. No, at that time they were normally filled.

Q. How did these quarters look?

A. At that period of time, living quarters looked the same as in a barracks. The internees still had bedclothing, and all necessary hygienic facilities. Everything was in the best of order.

DR. PANNENBECKER: That is all. I have no further questions.


Q. Witness, what was the greatest number of labour camps existing at any one time?

A. I cannot give the exact figure, but in my estimation there were approximately nine hundred.

Q. What was the population of these nine hundred?

A. I am not able to say that either; the population varied. There were camps with one hundred internees and camps with ten thousand internees. Therefore, I cannot give any figure of the total number of people who were in these labour camps.

Q. Under whose administration were the labour camps, under what offices?

A. These labour camps were, as far as the guarding, leadership and clothing were concerned, under the control of the main Economic and Administration Head Office. All matters dealing with labour and the supplying of food were attended to by the armament industries which employed these detainees.

Q. And at the end of the war were the conditions in those labour camps similar to those existing in the concentration camps as you described them before?

A. Yes. Since there was no longer any possibility of removing ill internees to the actual concentration camps, there was much overcrowding and the death rate was very high in these labour camps.