A. Yes, these two detention camps were not under the Inspectorate for Concentration Camps, but they were under an S.S. police court. I myself have neither inspected nor seen either of these two camps.

Q. So that you know nothing about the standing orders relating to those camps?

A. I know nothing about them.

DR. BABEL: I have no further questions to the witness.

THE PRESIDENT: The Tribunal will adjourn for ten minutes.

(A recess was taken.)

DR. KARL HAENSEL: I have a question that I would like to ask the High Tribunal. A second defence has been requested for the S.S. Is it permitted that several questions be put by the second defence counsel?

THE PRESIDENT: The Tribunal ruled, a long time ago, that only one counsel could be heard.


DR. KRANZBÜHLER (Counsel for defendant Dönitz):

Q. Witness, you just mentioned that members of the Navy were engaged in the guarding of concentration camps.

A. Yes.

Q. Were these concentration camps, or were they labour camps?

A. They were labour camps.

Q. Were labour camps auxiliary camps of the armament industries?

A. Yes, if they were not in the actual factories themselves, they were used as auxiliary camps.

Q. I have been informed that soldiers who were to be engaged for guard duty at labour camps were placed under the S.S.

A. That is only partially correct. A part of these men - I do not recall the figures - was taken over into the S.S. A part was returned to the original unit, or exchanged. Exchanges were continually taking place.


COLONEL AMEN: If the Tribunal please, first I would like to submit, on behalf of our British Allies, a series of exhibits pertaining to the Waffen S.S., without reading them. It is merely statistical information with respect to the number of Waffen S.S. guards used at the concentration camps.

I ask that the witness be shown Documents D-745-a-b, D-746-a-b, D-747, D148, D-749-b, and D-750, one of them being a statement of this witness.

(The documents were submitted to the witness.)


Q. Witness, you made the statement D-749-b which has been handed to you?

A. Yes.

Q. And you are familiar with the contents of the others?

A. Yes.

Q. And you testify that those figures are true and correct?

A. Yes.

Q. Very good.

COLONEL AMEN: These will become Exhibit USA 810.

Q. (continuing): Witness, from time to time did any high Nazi officials or functionaries visit the camp at Mauthausen or Dachau while you were there?

A. Yes.

Q. Will you state the names of such persons to the Tribunal please?

A. I remember that in 1935 all the Gauleiters inspected Dachau under the leadership of Reichsführer Himmler. I don't remember the individual names.

Q. Do you recall any of the ministers having visited either of those camps while you were there?

A. Do you mean by this the inspection tour of 1935?

Q. At any time while you were at either of those concentration camps.